E10 fuel - can a 302 use it?

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Jerryedmans
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E10 fuel - can a 302 use it?

Post by Jerryedmans »

Trying to work out what to do after listening to news and hearing E10 fuel has now arrived. Some articles written say classics can’t use others are more positive. Link below re positive can use it article pasted. https://ttypes.org/introduction-of-e10- ... ss-the-uk/
From what I’ve read E10 can eat certain types of plastic, aluminium and copper. Looking at the Hawk I’d have imagined the fuel hoses I put on in 2018 would have been compliant? But the engine does have a Holley Carb and Fuel pump, and Edelbrock aluminium intake manifold and cyclinder heads.
I felt reassured when I read the MGB article but thought I’d double check with RealSteel who built my engine. Hopeless - I got a stock answer that absolutely cannot use E10 but without any proper explanation. They did say UK E10 is not same and US alcohol based fuel. And that it can attack the seals in Holley fuel pumps. But could not or would not discuss impact on engine. Stock answer - you must use premium fuels instead.
Does anyone else have any more scientific explanation of what E10 might do and if there are things that can easily be done to convert - eg check fuel line spec, ditch the Holley pump and upgrade the carb? I am thinking that Gerry’s fuel line kit contained copper washers at the joints. I gather E10 hygroscopic and becomes acid with water and eats copper - perhaps the copper washers need replacing too?
Thanks for any input.

Cheers
J
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StewbieC
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Re: E10 fuel - can a 302 use it?

Post by StewbieC »

Hi Jerry,
I'm not using E10 in any of my older vehicles or petrol powertools. The hoses on my older petrol strimmer completely dissolved at the fuel tank end.
I now fill up with Esso Synergy Supreme 99 which is widely Ethanol free or E5 at worst. Yes its more expensive, but I wouldn't save £5 or £10 on a gallon of cheap oil or a cheap oil filter either as the negatives outweigh the benfits. Much the same as getting double jabbed :)
All of the other 97 or 99 Octane fuels are also staying at maximum E5 too.
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Jerryedmans
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Re: E10 fuel - can a 302 use it?

Post by Jerryedmans »

Thanks Stu. Just found this online - not a great advert for E10!

https://youtu.be/PKrdOMTaaTQ
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clive
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Re: E10 fuel - can a 302 use it?

Post by clive »

I spoke to my mower guru as I have a 35 year old ride on mower and various other old petrol machines. He recommends an additive for use on these which reduces the effect of ethanol. As I have 25:1, 40:1 and 50:1 ratio machines I will add the magic mixture to the bulk fuel and then mix the two stoke oil accordingly. I have in the meantime put Shell VMax in the ride on mower and I can now cut the grass in half the time! :lol: :lol: :lol:
Cheers, Clive.

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Re: E10 fuel - can a 302 use it?

Post by CobStang »

Man quit worrying, you should be running on super unleaded anyway, continue using super unleaded and drive on.
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peterc
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Re: E10 fuel - can a 302 use it?

Post by peterc »

I’ve just checked the Shell web site and they confirm that Shell V Power contains a maximum of 5% ethanol and will continue to be available at most petrol stations but they do suggest you check the label on the pump to confirm.
I believe most vehicles built after 2011 should be OK but anything older and obviously all classics, including our rebuilt cars should avoid the E10 as it eats the fuel components as advised earlier in this post.
Because I chose to enhance my engine last April I have been using the super grade anyway. As Stuart says it’s false economy to use poor grade of fuel just same as cheap oil. How this affects the grade of supermarket fuels I don’t know. Whilst I don’t normally fill up at a supermarket you can’t be sure that sometime in the future it’s that or nothing.
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clive
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Re: E10 fuel - can a 302 use it?

Post by clive »

As the new standard for petrol in the UK is going to be E10, then supermarket fuel will also need to comply and sell E10, so there won't be any benefit from buying from them. As far as I understand, all petrol engines will run on E10, but some components in the system will be damaged by the high ethanol content. It will not be like using unleaded in an older engine or diesel for that matter. Additives are available to counter the effects of E10 but I haven't seen any reviews yet. As for the argument that we should be using super unleaded as a norm, I would agree if we were all running highly tuned engines, but my fifty year old Ford 302 is more than happy to drink normal unleaded as recommended by Peter Knight of Knight Racing Services who built and supplied it more than 40,000 miles ago.
Cheers, Clive.

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amulheirn
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Re: E10 fuel - can a 302 use it?

Post by amulheirn »

Jerryedmans wrote: Wed Sep 01, 2021 11:31 am Trying to work out what to do after listening to news and hearing E10 fuel has now arrived. Some articles written say classics can’t use others are more positive.
...
I did an article for the mag a few editions ago - I contacted the suppliers of the various parts used in a Hawk for the fuel system (line, pump, regulator, filter), and also got input from Holley and Edelbrock about their carbs. The conclusion I came to was not to worry about it, but include a check of your fuel line every few years as a matter of course.

Also, it sounds like Esso might be worth checking out, based on this thread: https://www.the289register.com/phpBB3/v ... E10#p36055
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amulheirn
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Re: E10 fuel - can a 302 use it?

Post by amulheirn »

When I looked at various additive makers' claims, I couldn't really see anything in their bumf about how the products worked, so I assumed there was a fair amount of 'magic' about them. Some even still had names that implied they prevented valve seat damage (something I thought was a worry only with the use of unleaded petrol on non-hardened valve seats), so I thought perhaps the marketing people were latching onto our worries to make a quick profit.

Just saw this though - Frost's do an additive and explain how it works a bit better than most. And FBHVC seem to have endorsed it too. https://www.frost.co.uk/protect-your-ve ... ed-petrol/
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Re: E10 fuel - can a 302 use it?

Post by colinA »

You can still get TEL (lead) as an additive in the UK. It's sold under the name 'Tetraboost'.
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