Hey guys
A question about lifter tick.
For some time I have had a lifter tick on start up, sounds like just the one, quite loud after a lay up, after a few minutes does go away.
Today I thought I would try to locate it. I tried listening in the past, could not even decide which side it was on.
So I thought right bank, removed rocker cover and tried to turn pushrods, all had contact and all turned except very front one, could not turn it ?
Started engine and went along rockers listening with a large screwdriver, sure enough front rocker was noisy, noise then gradually went and rocker sounded the same as the rest. Horrah, found it !
Stopped engine, left for a few minutes, could then turn pushrod on front rocker.
Now, most folks seem to have a tick from a collapsed lifter, I seem to have a tick from a hard lifter.
Does anyone have any idea what is going on here ?
Do I need to remove the lifter and clean it out, is the ball valve blocked ?
Engine is Rover 3.9, Typhoon cam, Rhoads lifters, spotlessly clean inside, new oil every 3k miles.
Cheers
Mark
Lifter tick
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Dave Woodward
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Re: Lifter tick
Won’t the ability to turn a push rod be dictated by the position of the cam? I don’t think you’d expect to find all pushrods ‘loose’ in their rocker seat? Any that are in the process of lifting the valve will tight.
Apols if misunderstanding your post.
Apols if misunderstanding your post.
__________________________________
I say, ding dong!
I say, ding dong!
Re: Lifter tick
Engine was purposely left for several days to allow lifters to bleed down in order to promote as much tick as possible. Before starting I tried to turn all the pushrods in order to find a real easy one, or as in this case one with different feel. Even if a valve was fully open the lifter would bleed down over time. Now whether there is enough movement in the lifter plunger to bleed out if a valve was fully open and then go slack, I do not know. Can that front pushrod have been the only one to stop in a fully open position, I don't know.
I guess I need to check again tomorrow and see if the front pushrod is still under tension, or if another pushrod is ?
That pushrod that did not turn IS the one making the noise though.
I guess I need to check again tomorrow and see if the front pushrod is still under tension, or if another pushrod is ?
That pushrod that did not turn IS the one making the noise though.
Re: Lifter tick
I agree with Dave. You need to rotate the cam to each position where the tappet is on the back of the lobe. This is where the tappet is free to do its pre load job.
Of course it’s possible you have one dodgy lifter.
Do you have adjustable rockers or do you use spacers on the whole rocker assembly.
If you have the time/ money you could swap the suspect tappet to a different position to check.
Either way it sounds like removing the inlet manifold and the cost of a new valley gasket .
Peter C
Of course it’s possible you have one dodgy lifter.
Do you have adjustable rockers or do you use spacers on the whole rocker assembly.
If you have the time/ money you could swap the suspect tappet to a different position to check.
Either way it sounds like removing the inlet manifold and the cost of a new valley gasket .
Peter C
Re: Lifter tick
When I added roller rockers to my Rover I worked to the following info.
Find TDC with No1 firing position.( Check dizzy for No1 and front pulley.)
Set intakes 2 & 7 and exhausts 4 & 8
Turn engine 1/2 rotation.
Set intakes 1 & 8 and exhausts 3 & 6
Turn engine 1/2 turn
Set intakes 3 & 4 and exhausts 5 & 7
Turn engine 1/2 rotation
Set intakes 5 & 6 and exhausts 1 & 2
This ensures that the relevant lifter is on the back of cam lobe.
Worked fine for me.
One thing I found was I had to rotate the engine twice slowly (without any oil pressure) to ensure that the lifters were properly collapsed.
Be careful if you decide to lift out a pushrod as it can easily pull the lifter up with it. Then you will have to take the valley gasket off.
Peter C
Find TDC with No1 firing position.( Check dizzy for No1 and front pulley.)
Set intakes 2 & 7 and exhausts 4 & 8
Turn engine 1/2 rotation.
Set intakes 1 & 8 and exhausts 3 & 6
Turn engine 1/2 turn
Set intakes 3 & 4 and exhausts 5 & 7
Turn engine 1/2 rotation
Set intakes 5 & 6 and exhausts 1 & 2
This ensures that the relevant lifter is on the back of cam lobe.
Worked fine for me.
One thing I found was I had to rotate the engine twice slowly (without any oil pressure) to ensure that the lifters were properly collapsed.
Be careful if you decide to lift out a pushrod as it can easily pull the lifter up with it. Then you will have to take the valley gasket off.
Peter C
Last edited by peterc on Sat Nov 18, 2023 11:59 am, edited 2 times in total.
Re: Lifter tick
If it's only ticking for a few minutes on a cold start, I would leave it.
Cheers, Clive.
(If I'm not here I'm in my workshop or on the golf course!)
(If I'm not here I'm in my workshop or on the golf course!)
Re: Lifter tick
The results from today.
First thing I set the offending lifter at maximum opening point and went out for the day.
It bled down and tonight I could not turn the pushrod, so the piston in the lifter had bottomed out and the lifter was still lifting the valve, so in the first instance of investigating it was pure fluke that the noise was coming from the only pushrod not to turn.
I reassembled the engine and started it, oh boy it clattered badly for at least a minute after the oil pressure came up to 40 psi, then it went quiet - well quiet for Rhoads lifters. So bleeding out the offending lifter totally certainly gave my ears, and probably the camshaft a bashing.
So it is pot luck whether or not the offending lifter gets totally bled out when the engine stops, if it rests on the heel of the cam then the noise at start up is less.
I would like to know if the lifter oil gallery is fed from both ends ? anyone know ?
I know there is a bung in the valley at the front of the engine. I was wondering if the front lifter was being starved of oil by a silt blockage, but then you would think the next one along would be similarly affected.
I guess I may have a lazy lifter, and I either have to remove the intake and sort it, or leave it be.
At the moment referring back to a comp test in April, that No 2 cylinder had the best pressure of all of them, so I do not think the camshaft is being damaged - yet.
Hey ho, isn't life fun......
First thing I set the offending lifter at maximum opening point and went out for the day.
It bled down and tonight I could not turn the pushrod, so the piston in the lifter had bottomed out and the lifter was still lifting the valve, so in the first instance of investigating it was pure fluke that the noise was coming from the only pushrod not to turn.
I reassembled the engine and started it, oh boy it clattered badly for at least a minute after the oil pressure came up to 40 psi, then it went quiet - well quiet for Rhoads lifters. So bleeding out the offending lifter totally certainly gave my ears, and probably the camshaft a bashing.
So it is pot luck whether or not the offending lifter gets totally bled out when the engine stops, if it rests on the heel of the cam then the noise at start up is less.
I would like to know if the lifter oil gallery is fed from both ends ? anyone know ?
I know there is a bung in the valley at the front of the engine. I was wondering if the front lifter was being starved of oil by a silt blockage, but then you would think the next one along would be similarly affected.
I guess I may have a lazy lifter, and I either have to remove the intake and sort it, or leave it be.
At the moment referring back to a comp test in April, that No 2 cylinder had the best pressure of all of them, so I do not think the camshaft is being damaged - yet.
Hey ho, isn't life fun......